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pistol permit denied
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Thread: pistol permit denied

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    18

    Default pistol permit denied

    I received notice this week in the mail that my pistol permit application was denied. I was slightly apprehensive about being denied due to an "aggravated
    unlicensed operation" charge which I plead guilty to with charges dismissed in court. "Aggravated" not exactly the reason, more of a forgetfulness to renew my license. Regardless, it is a "misdemeanor" and I felt that the level of impact it would have on my character would be negligible when considered. After all it was not a felony, and was non-violent.

    I also take the medication, welbutrin. This is a mild antidepressant medication that can also be beneficial for improved attention in some like myself. I voluntarily take this medication as I find that improves my mood and my day to day work. Every three months I see a psychiatrist to obtain a new prescription. The application asks if you have been treated for mental illness or depression. I circled depression. The permit office demanded that I provide these medical records from my doctor. When applying for a permit you essentially give up your right to patient doctor confidentiality. You give up a right in order to exercise another. The reason this confidentiality right exists is so that patients are not fearful of seeking treatment under scrutiny of the government or any private organization. Nonetheless, I turned over my psychiatrist's notes. I felt, if anything, these documents would actually confirm the stability of my mental state. After all, plenty of people take psychiatric meds, right? It's not uncommon.

    On both of these assumptions, I was incorrect. My permit was denied for the two reasons above. I was declared to have a mental disorder based on these documents, and that I had not been truthful and lack the required candor. How this was possible evades me considering I gave them these documents and they are in no way a legal definition of a "mental disorder." You may look this up for yourself and find that common "symptoms" such as mine are almost never considered to be in this category. As far as the misdemeanor goes, this was considered to be a clear lack of judgement on my part. With both of these in consideration, my permit was denied.

    There's a few disturbing revelation in this.

    The first is an issue of what types of misdemeanors or violations, if any, should and will be considered. A speeding ticket, a record of repeated accidents, or running a red light would be traffic violations, and I suspect would most likely not be considered in any way when issuing a permit. But a suspended license misdemeanor is. A misdemeanor that did not exist until 2006. At what point does one draw the line? What is considered to be bad judgement and what isn't? How far and how deeply will we look into a person's past and make a judgement about who they are as a person? There are no clear cut definitions and an applicant is merely at the mercy of a judge and licensing officer to make this determination.

    The second is more disturbing. Essentially, any current or would be holder of a permit should be aware that they could now be listed as "mentally ill" by the county of Westchester merely for voluntarily seeking treatment for anxiety, depression, obsessive compulsive behavior, or substance abuse. Legally mentally ill persons typically suffer from psychosis, a severe and difficult to control mental illness, and now anyone could potentially be determined to exist in this same category. The county has now essentially put fear into any individual who wishes to voluntarily seek treatment for psychiatric concerns, lest they be labeled and denied a permit.

    I hope this sheds some light on the Westchester process and serves as a cautionary tale for any of you who are thinking of applying or reapplying. I plan on appealing my case, and will keep you posted. Until then, I am still a proud and responsible owner of a Sig 556, S&W M&P 15-22, and Browning BPS, and you can still find me at the trap or rifle range whenever I find the time. Thanks for reading.
    Last edited by rumbles; 01-31-2012 at 02:22 PM. Reason: spelling

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Springwater
    Posts
    7,552

    Default

    Wow, sorry to hear you have to deal with this issue with the county. Definitely appeal it and keep us updated. Do you plan to hire an attorney to help you with the appeal process?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    niskyuna
    Posts
    86

    Default

    Unless you have a felony or domestic violence or have been deemed mentaly incompotent by a Dr they cannot deny your permit. I hope u appeal this I think you will win it.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    "Putnam" County NY
    Posts
    36

    Default

    sorry to hear about your denial. this is why I moved to putnam and will apply there. Enough with the bs that is the county of westchester already! Good luck

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Putnam County, NY
    Posts
    855

    Default

    I always thought that one had to be "institutionalized" to be considered deficient, for lack of the proper term, to obtain a CHL.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Putnam County, NY
    Posts
    855

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rich2577 View Post
    sorry to hear about your denial. this is why I moved to putnam and will apply there. Enough with the bs that is the county of westchester already! Good luck
    Welcome to Putnam, you'll be treated respectfully up here. They issue non-restricted license here also.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Putnam County
    Posts
    855

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ladder13 View Post
    They issue non-restricted license here also.
    Eventually.
    Jim

    NRA Life Member, GOA, SAF, NYRPA, S.C.O.P.E.

    We must, indeed, all hang together, or assuredly we shall all hang separately. - Benjamin Franklin

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Putnam County, NY
    Posts
    855

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by minderasr View Post
    Eventually.
    True, you need to wait about 1 year, and make do with a H&T. My guess though, is no one really cares.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Dutchess County
    Posts
    111

    Default

    Putnam County does NOT issue full carry permits. After a year, you can request a hearing to see the judge for the full carry.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    Wow, sorry to hear you have to deal with this issue with the county. Definitely appeal it and keep us updated. Do you plan to hire an attorney to help you with the appeal process?
    I'm not sure yet if I'll get representation or represent myself in an appeal. An appeal would typically just require a brief and/or oral argument. I'm finding out today if it's eligible for internal appeal or if I have to go to article 78. I've spoken to a couple lawyer friends and I've gotten quotes from 8k-10k+ to sue in state court (likely federal). Will have more information shortly.

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